WHAT IS THE CURRENT STATE OF THE NGO SECTOR IN IRAQ? AN INTERVIEW
By Janice Duddy

November 28, 2003 – (AWID Resource Net Friday File, Issue 154) Interview with Lesley Abdela, from Shevolution. Lesley was recently working in Iraq on helping to develop civil society and NGO sectors, especially with women’s organizations.

AWID: Could you briefly tell me about your work in Iraq.

I was working with an American group called RTI, Research Triangle Institute based in North Carolina they have been working on issues of local government in Iraq. it is They recruited me to work on civil society. I was working with human rights groups and women’s groups. I was based in South Central Province which is about an hour-and-a-half south of Baghdad, in the towns of Hilla, Kerbala (a religious centre of the Shiites) , and Diwania.

AWID: From your experience, how does the average Iraqi feel about the occupation?

In the region where I was, is the heartland of the Shia, the people that rose up against Saddam in 1991. They thought that if they rose up America and others would support them but they didn’t. They paid a very high price.

Around the town of Hilla, the old Babylon of history, there have been 80 mass graves already found. Hundreds and thousands of people in that region where killed in reprisals and tortured.

It is very hard for me to say what the average Iraqi feels. Although I have met with about 300 people, mainly women and human rights groups, because of the security situation we could not go to shops, restaurants, or other public places. I have never worked in those conditions before. Usually, when I am working in another country I end up going home to people’s houses or we end up going out for coffee together, this allows people to become really relax and chat. During this experience we were not in this situation. Even though it was not as bad in the area where we were compared to Baghdad it was very difficult to assess what people really felt. We didn’t discuss it to be honest. Because of the security reasons I didn’t feel that I got to know anyone well enough for them to speak openly with me.

From our point of view where we were, let me explain our security situation. I can’t say that we were ever directly fired at. There was quite a bit of
shooting in the evenings but it was quite often weddings, they have three day weddings where they shoot guns off. There was also criminal-on-criminal shootings and an occasional explosion, for instance outside the police station. We had to have body guards wherever we went. It was hard for me to tell if it the group we were working was being over-cautious of if in fact they were being correct and it was truly dangerous.

What you are seeing on the television is right in terms of security but what you are not seeing is what is happening on the ground by civilians, for
instance, citizens are repairing sewage and setting up women’s centres.

Things are happening faster in Iraq than in Kosovo because you don’t have to coordinate with many other groups. You can just get things done faster on a practical level.

AWID: Do you feel that women’s lives have improved or gotten worse since the occupation?

When you have a dangerous situation, it makes if very difficult for women to move around. Also, there is a lot of intimidation going on from the Islamic fascist and fundamentalist groups. It was being reported back to me that if women are not wearing their head scarf they are getting leaned on.

In terms of rights, when you have high unemployment (currently in Iraq there is 80% unemployment) and other stresses it has got to be bad for women. Life is very hard for everybody and when it is hard for everybody you can be sure that women are going to be taking the brunt of it. If you are a widow or a divorced woman it is extremely hard because it is not socially acceptable for you to go out and about or go to work without somebody escorting you.

What I found very interesting was that the women we were working with, who were a mixture of incredibly religious women in black full veils and to others who were in modern dress, were all focused on getting women represented on any committee deciding constitution, in parliament, or in any situation where women’s rights in constitution could be promoted. The first thing that they said to me, before I said anything, was we want to get women on the committee deciding constitution because we want women’s equal rights enshrined in the constitution, we have been oppressed long enough. Also Iraqi women wanted to have at least 35-40% women in any parliament that was selected.

AWID: What is the state of the NGO sector in Iraq, particularly women’s NGO?

Under Saddam there were not any NGOs. There have always been women’s organizations, there were big ones before Saddam and under Saddam, but they were very much part of the system. The ones that are starting now are working outside of that system. It is important to understand that there is still not a system in place for registering NGOs in Iraq.

In terms of NGO work people have been incredibly cutoff. To give you an example, I was working with a human rights organization in Hilla, it
consisted of about 30 lawyers (mostly men but women as well) where a computer centre had just opened in their building. The second or third day I was working with them I asked, “Which international human right groups are you in touch with, with Amnesty International, Human Rights Watch, or International Crisis Group?” and they said “With who?”. They had had no contact with an international organization. We went into the computer room and sent an email making contact with international organizations and now they are in touch with the rest of the world. Under the Baathist nobody was allowed to use email except good party members and then they were monitored.

I have worked in many countries where people have been cut-off but not as cut-off as this from information. And yet, there are many well-educated people, that is another thing that doesn’t come through on Western news.

AWID: What are the major issues facing women’s NGOs and what skill and resources are needed to tackle these issues?

Surviving financially is a big one. Investment, getting them up and running as a business, also making them viable careers and professions is another important aspect. Internet and the English language is going to be something that is very much needed. I am seeing a rich-poor divide opening up in many countries between those people that can use the email and internet and can speak English and those that can’t. Obviously, the agricultural side of things, because besides oil Iraq is a big agricultural producer. It keeps coming back to what we are seeing on t.v., you have got to get security right. If it is not safe to go around, it doesn’t matter what skills you have got. For women it is more difficult for women to go out and about, it really is a safety issue.

Medicines and hospitals are needed. But you have a strange situations.

Americans were trying to do what people suggested, which was to hand over money and decision-making power to the Iraqis. They handed over millions of dollars in July to the Ministry of Health and Education so that the Iraqis could make their own decisions. They were encouraging them to do it at local levels. But when I left in October, only between 10-15% of that money had been spent. This is because people at the local level are still frightened to make a decision without the say-so of Baghdad, in case the Baathist came back. Also, in Baghdad there is a Secretary General of the Accountancy Department is a big Baathist who has stopped the supply of money (I am not sure why he is still there). You have these sort of problems. It is all very well to hand-over to Iraqis but there will be transition through difficult periods.

AWID: Have you seen any parallels in the development of the NGO sector in Iraq and in Kosovo, where you have also worked?

Kosovo is a very different situation. The people in Kosovo, the ethnic Albanians, had run an alternative society for 10 years under Milosevic. They
had a tradition there of doing their own thing. I have not found this situation in any other communist country. They are quite use to running their own schools and alternative health system. They even paid a 3% voluntary tax to support their own alternative system. Much of that was NGOs running a whole society. When it came to actually registering NGOs what I call service-provider NGOs were there and ready to go. What was new in
Kosovo is the idea of NGOs as agents and campaigners of change. We were training NGO leaders from environmental groups, youth groups, women’s groups, and human rights groups on how to campaign, how you can persuade your politicians and UN representatives to bring in legislation you want and that the citizens need and how to brief them on issues. In Iraq, that is absolutely unheard of because you never questioned authority.

In terms of NGO it is still too early. They are beginning, women’s groups, human rights groups, and also environmental groups. Anything that can be done to encourage this is really positive. In a country like Iraq with many different sectors and ethnic and tribal groups (e.g. Kurds, Shiites) civil society is going to be so important.

AWID: In your opinion, what needs to happen to develop a strong NGO sector in Iraq?

What would be very useful, is that the NGO people themselves need to spend 2-3 months of structured time with NGOs in places like Canada, US, UK, and Europe. Then they can go back and work in partnership with NGOs in other countries. We have all networked and learned from each other. What is also needed is to have the contact. Many Iraqis asked for more contact with similar groups in other countries, on email, internet, exchange visits, conferences, they are very thirsty for this. Any direct contact that Iraqi groups could make with groups outside of the country would be very valuable.